Replies: 19 comments 1 reply
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right, when the input one and two are not the same profile, the profile of input one i used because you cant really transfer P7 from one source to another.
mkvtoolnix does not discard EL when you mux a DL TS, it never happened to me.
…On Tuesday, January 7th, 2025 at 00:23, tjayz ***@***.***> wrote:
When I inject into an MKV with P7 RPU this functions as intended.
When I inject into naked MKV or P8, for some reason the FEL EL is automatically converted into P8 MEL. EL came directly from source and is definitely FEL and correctly identified as such by your tool.
Upgraded to Ugoos from x800m2 and had a bunch of DL-DT TS that needed converting to MKV and mkvtool often discards the EL entirely if not directly from the source leaving a naked HDR MKV which requires injecting and P8 MEL is undesirable if the EL is FEL.
Not sure if this is a bug or one of my tools mismatched but with Ugoos players being king now this function is highly desirable for MKVs.
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If length of video is the same should be able to transfer. You keep all your media lossless which not everyone does. I encode BL to conserve space as I only have 8TB on two ssds. After you encode the BL it was issue free to slap the EL back with the encoded BL into a DLDT ts, and if the EL comes direct from the BDMV mpls mkvtoolnix will properly mux DTDL into STDL. You cannot encode BL from a STDL mkv and slap the EL back in even though they are from the same source. The workaround requires having the large files of BDMV mpls. Would be ideal to just download a remux that is STDL and be able to encode the BL and inject the EL back in. |
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You can't add the EL back to a re-encoded hevc stream in any way, not even from original mpls/m2ts. Dolby tools encode the BL and EL in a specific way( same IPB frame). When you encode the BL, you destroy that order. Instead, you have to bake the EL into the BL with P8 metadata when you encode the new hevc stream. Workflow 8-2-1
Works fine on my end. Almost all the DLDT TS I remuxed in mkvtoolnix were originally muxed in my script 4-3 from ST-DL |
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Humour me and try it and tell me what's wrong with it. Take original mpls stream and demux with tsmuxer to m2ts the BL and encode it. Then add to tsmuxer the BL with the original mpls stream deselecting the unencoded BL original. This can than be converted to STDL P7 fel with mkvtoolnix. I notice no descriptive differences on cpm coreELEC info nor on useless mediaiinfo outside of the obvious. What other tests corroborate authenticity or prove corruption? I do not doubt what you say, just learn a different way. |
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Yes, the file will play but it's technically incorrect, similar to these. |
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I always assumed EL was linked to time. They made it be linked to both time and frame type is what you are saying to sort of give it an extra layer of syncing, probably intention too to make it that much harder to mimic their software, and if the EL mismatched the BL at and any given time where the frame type differs, the result would be unpredictable cracked out brightness and or colours? So if I use workflow 8-2-1 the resulting encoded BL will have perfectly synced EL and even though it is profile 8 it is still same as p7 FEL? Will cpm corelec still call it p8 mel though? Just wondering how you can tell something you did not encode is p8 fel such as from a download. |
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I have no idea what kind of issue it could cause.
Yes, 8-2-1, will merge the EL+BL together. The result is P8 and identical to FEL P7 playback on 10-bit TVs, see my old comparison.
You can use workflow 7-2 and compare a bunch of screenshots. Input the original P7 rip and the encode. This workflow only works with an nvidia GPU. FYI: 8-2-1 encoding works without nvidia. |
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So no you cannot tell if a download is p8 fel directly unless comparing to p7 fel source, which why would you download it if you had that. The only way to be sure is encode it yourself. I see workflow 821 has line 146 option for nvenc. Been long time since I used that but I recall that being inferior in every way back in the day. Has that come to be on par with cpu encoding quality at identical compression? Obviously much faster but if cannot maintain the same quality at the same compression level then is useless imo, just cpu encode while you sleeping. |
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To follow up, would the resulting TS DLDT described above be correct as the streams each have independent IBP frames and therefore the EL layer would be operating correctly as its untouched regardless of the BL being encoded? I watched a couple dozen movies like this and never noticed issues. If so simply change my request to "Feature Request: Inject P7 FEL into naked HDR (or P8) source resulting in P7 DL-DT FEL MKV". I never understood why mkvtool merged the EL into SL. Obviously if it had an EL in SLDT form that would need to be stripped and the injection forms the DTDL to be clear. |
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CPU encoding will always be better...
If you mux raw hevc stream in mkvtoolnix, it should make a DT-DL MKV but I don't see the point of doing that. Just use ST-DL.
yes |
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You never answered a previous question I had that explains the point: "Take original mpls stream and demux with tsmuxer to m2ts the BL and encode it. Then add to tsmuxer the BL with the original mpls stream deselecting the unencoded BL original...would the resulting TS DLDT described above be correct as the streams each have independent IBP frames and therefore the EL layer would be operating correctly as its untouched regardless of the BL being encoded?" I have followed the "Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux" almost from the day it was made up until around page 400 or so when I had an x800m2. I have had to change my entire library several times throughout the years changing tv's and bluray players and recognize with the Ugoos the final change is now as it accepts mkv/chapters and I NEVER want to do this again and simply do not have the time anymore to read forums everyday to keep up with the changes and how better the understanding of DV encoding has become. Murphy's Law, anything that can go wrong will go wrong. Solution, change as little as possible to prevent anything going wrong. If money grew on trees I would build a 250TB NAS and keep everything mkv STDL lossless easy. Keeping audio and EL lossless is never more than 5gb on an average file, moving forward I see no way around BL encoding. So Ideally mkv DTDL p7 is as close as you can get given as described above making it a STDL could cause problems on some files given BL and EL would have mismatched IBP frames. Dovi Baker is perhaps the perfect solution but I do not want to find out in a years time that something was misunderstood, required an update and I need to redo my entire library again because the BL has EL baked in required redownloading original source and doing all over again. You used to say something like you do not need to keep all 3 of the 100 600 and 1000 nit profiles and now say need to keep them and now you must change the 4000 to 1000 etc etc I cannot keep up with it all I do not have the time, point is you keep learning the correct way and things must be changed. You are the expert no question, I the amateur hobbyist, and understand it is an evolving process as you learn it all, it is in my best interests to do what is best for my library and keep it in a state that makes any new knowledge gained in the future easy to fix my library without having to reencode or download anything. You question why not just do STDL, I question why use Dovi Baker at all if it is not needed.
Now back to your original suggestion, I have tried this and is problematic as the EL layer will always be given as "dvhe. 07.03, BL+EL+RPU". To be clear both layers were demuxed to separate hevc's and tried putting either one back in tsmuxer before muxing in mkvtool and result is the same as keeping both raw. Any way around this? It does not play properly it stutters profusely but does trigger both video layers. If I can solve the problem above, I intend to do comparative analysis between Dovi Baker encode, the mkv DTDL p7, and the original source using a variety of plots and workflow 72 you mentioned earlier. Sorry for the novel but think we on the same page now anyways. |
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No, it doesn't matter what you do, it's still technically incorrect. You cannot re-encode the BL without the official Dolby Vision Engine. The EL is always encoded by analyzing the master and the HDR10 base layer. The player doesn't care if it is a DT or ST rip, it will decode both layers and reconstruct a new HEVC stream that is sent to the TV in a RGB container.
what? I still think that the generated trims don't look right, especially with the low-nits scenes, nothing changed.
Anyway, you can do whatever you prefer, I'm just saying that there is no point in re-encoding P7 without baking the EL. I'm not sure why you are trying to convince me.
Mux it to DT-DL MP4 first, then to MKV |
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You misunderstand. It’s me who needs convincing because I do not want to waste my time encoding a library again in the future.
Wish you would have said that sooner. To be clear this applies to any DV profile 5, 7 mel/fel or 8 correct? Has anyone else done some testing on this showing differences? Would be curious to watch it. Since I already encoded a whole video I will do the testing for shits n giggles after I try first muxing as mp4 as you suggested. Would be rather confusing if they were the same… will report back either way. |
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So I did workflow 7-2 comparing original bluray m2ts, Dovi Baker encode and mkv STDL BL encoded and almost all frames were identical and the two sets which had variation the encodes were exact match meaning encoding was the culprit. The workflow 6-3 L1 plots of the first two were exact matches with barely detectable differences in the latter (using slideshow fullscreen fit image to screen in win10 photos app). I then proceeded to use your tool to convert the mkv STDL back into ts DTDL and was surprised to see the L1 was an exact match to the original source again. I then proceeded to convert the mkv STDL to ts STDL and found the L1 plot to be the exact match of the mkv STDL. This suggests mkv is not the source of variation, rather ST is.
I tried your suggestion to make DTDL mkv which worked to make the DV data be reported correctly, however the stutter issue persists. Converting this mkv back to ts both DTDL /STDL does not stutter so the problem to continue testing is how to mux mkv DTDL without issue. I swear I have seen DTDL mkv downloads which played before but cannot recall which ones... L4/5 plots were exact matches with L5 being a flat line on all. My L238 plots and L6 plots have this abstract art look issue. How to resolve? I have python 3.12 (windows version) with all libraries mentioned installed and avisynth, lav filters, and vapoursynth, with current dolby tools v 5.5. |
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FEL sometimes does nothing. check one of the movies known for expanding the brightness.
all the profiles and formats ( ST or DT P7 or SL P8/P5) have the same metadata. Tools cannot change the dynamic metadata.
yeah MKV container is not really intended for dual-track playback I guess.
what the hell lol... Never seen this before so I have no idea what's going on. |
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Was Mel title, Dune part 1.
Putting an encoded BL into SLDT with unencoded EL in either TS or MKV does in fact cause change see for yourself.
The lines become darker shades of blue, more pronounced in some areas the lines are longer.
This is incorrect and solved. Feel rather dumb for not trying it sooner. Think extremely basic, how is the EL layer identified in its native m2ts format... it is generic "HDR format: SMPTE ST 2086, HDR compatible". Adding dual hevc streams to mkvtool directly attempts to identify it automatically and is incorrect leads to stutters. Mp4muxer is the solution as suggested:
Attempting to add --dv-profile flags breaks it, causes the stutters. Add output.mp4 to mkvtoolnix and resultant mkv dual stream will play properly with encoded BL. Now need to test many samples of encodes vs dovi baker.
Before I can do that though need to resolve this issue. Instructions here https://github.com/R3S3t9999/DoVi_Scripts do not match instructions here https://github.com/R3S3t9999/DoVi_Scripts/blob/main/TOOLS%20%26%20INSTALLATION and differs from the video as well here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SLtsVDse2w. Is Microsoft Visual C++ Redistributable required? Whats going on with all these paths exactly: set metafier_path=https://customer.dolby.com/content-creation-and-delivery/dolby-vision-professional-tools? Which exact versions of python, avisynth, vapoursynth and lavfilters do you have installed? Thanks. |
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That is exactly the kind of issue to expect when you re-encode the BL. If you look at the comparisons in the examples of miss-encoded bluray disc Iist I already gave you. metadata frames are lost when you mux the BL and EL together because the BL has not been encoded properly.
Whats going on with all these paths exactly: set metafier_path=https://customer.dolby.com/content-creation-and-delivery/dolby-vision-professional-tools? Which exact versions of python, avisynth, vapoursynth and lavfilters do you have installed? Thanks. Follow the video tutorial. The latest version of all these softwares should be fine. For the dolby tools, you have to download them yourself, they are freely available in that link
yes |
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Only exists in STDL. Whole Point of this is to see if DTDL works with encoded BL exactly the same as if using dovi baker. That is the test 😂
I have done this and installed redistributable and even deleted tools folder and reinstalled fresh copy. Still have the abstract art issue. |
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No...
I don't know and that's just some basic plot script, no software is required really... it use jq.exe to parse the data and gnuplot to plot so look on the website to see if something is missing.. |
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When I deleted my tools folder had backups of tsmuxer and other tools in there. Trying to fix the plot issue renaming folders and moving things inside old folders to new folders in case there was a permissions issue, led to me no longer being able to reproduce my work. Cannot even get tsmuxer DTDL to play anymore and no longer have the x800m2 to test configurations I knew played. Anyways going to cave and just use dovi baker as going down this rabbit hole any further is likely a waste of time. |
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When I inject into an MKV with P7 RPU this functions as intended.
When I inject into naked MKV or P8, for some reason the FEL EL is automatically converted into P8 MEL. EL came directly from source and is definitely FEL and correctly identified as such by your tool.
Upgraded to Ugoos from x800m2 and had a bunch of DL-DT TS that needed converting to MKV and mkvtool often discards the EL entirely if not directly from the source leaving a naked HDR MKV which requires injecting and P8 MEL is undesirable if the EL is FEL.
Not sure if this is a bug or one of my tools mismatched but with Ugoos players being king now this function is highly desirable for MKVs.
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